Something I don't get.. Plot hole?
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — The Usual Suspects
dim_sum11 — 12 years ago(February 24, 2014 08:04 AM)
Spoiler warning.
So the point of the boat job was to kill the one guy who had seen Kaizer but then Kaizer basically reveals who he is to the cops at the end anyway, so what was the point? -
jbaddock — 12 years ago(February 24, 2014 12:25 PM)
That's true if Verbal actually is Soze - there's enough room for doubt about that (the man Kovash describes is the one who was doing all the killing on the ship - doesn't mean to say it was Soze, or even Verbal - there's more than a resemblance to Kobayashi as well in the image). Kujan clearly thinks Verbal was Soze, but that was quite possibly what Verbal wanted him to believe all along - he knows that all Kujan has to do is look at the wall and his whole story unravels - which is what he wants.
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Stratego — 12 years ago(February 24, 2014 12:34 PM)
His face is not important, even when the police thought Keaton was Soze they didn't believe he was going to show up again if he was still alive. Marquez had intimate knowledge of his business. This would destroy his criminal empire and certainly put him in jail.
And Verbal didn't reveal anything. All Kujan found out was that he told a big bunch of lies. It was the fax that revealed he was the gunman, and Verbal knew nothing about the Hungarian's survival. -
Cradocus — 11 years ago(May 20, 2014 02:27 PM)
Actually the stupid part is that Keyser - the super rich criminal's plan to take down the boat/witness, is an elaborate scheme to use 4 guys and a couple machine guns.
Maybe you know, he could have just hired a few goons with a rocket launcher and some grenades. -
Stratego — 11 years ago(June 03, 2014 04:38 PM)
Maybe you know, he could have just hired a few goons with a rocket launcher and some grenades.
That would have immediately pointed to Keyser Soze, though. He wanted to sell it to the police as a dope deal gone wrong, so that wouldn't have worked. -
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mail-2217 — 11 years ago(June 02, 2014 10:03 PM)
This is a completely valid criticism. It's like many b-movie film noires. There really is no point to -any- of it if you think too hard. Verbal doesn't have to sit down for the interview. Verbal doesn't need to do -anything-, really.
It's a movie.
But I don't say that with disdain. I -love- this movie. If movies were like life, they'd be too dismal to watch. -
There_Is_No_Sayid — 11 years ago(September 23, 2014 10:50 AM)
Keyser screws up. He doesn't realize that a) one of the Hungarians survived the explosion and can identify him and b) that Kujan will realize that he invented many of the details of the story and conclude that he's Keyser Soze. While the film portrays Soze as a master criminal, the guy isn't god. He needed the assistance of Dean Keaton and the others to get on the ship and he managed to get caught by the police as he fled the scene.
Unless Alpert's covered in bacon grease, I don't think Hugo can track anything. -
drystyx — 11 years ago(December 01, 2014 09:08 AM)
Because the name "Kaiser Soze" is itself not who he is. He is Satan. "Kaiser" is derived from "Caesar", and is merely the Hungarian's word for the ruler of Hell.
Keaton and his girlfriend infringed on the copyright of Satan, and imagined themselves bigger than Satan. It's the reverse of the God complex, and much more common, since it's easier to imagine being a perfect evil than a perfect good.
The clues are there throughout as Keaton practically boasts about being a super Satan, and his lawyer girlfriend is obviously worse, and also she's obviously the brains. She has a bigger "Satan" complex than Keaton does. It's her that ultimately is in the office of the devil, trying to seal the deal, being outwitted the entire way.
Think of the movie as a mirror image to her story. It's showing what happens behind the scenes in her deal with the devil.
But you can't deal with the Devil.
Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time -
Duluume — 11 years ago(January 19, 2015 05:47 AM)
ok huh?
I'm sure that you put a lot of thinking coming to this conclusion, but I honestly don't see anything else but gibberish in your analysis.
Don't take it wrong: I'm not trolling nor am I willingly agressif, but I just don't get the whole Satan thing as well as the role of Keaton's girlfriend ni your mind.
Cheers -
king_of_bob — 11 years ago(February 08, 2015 05:04 PM)
So the point of the boat job was to kill the one guy who had seen Kaizer but then Kaizer basically reveals who he is to the cops at the end anyway, so what was the point?
It was many birds with one stone. Each of the "Suspects" had wronged Soze at some point in their career. So he gathered them all together to help him eliminate a witness and at the same time give him the opportunity to take out each of the "Suspects."
And he doesn't reveal who he really is to the cops. They might suspect that the guy they were talking to is Soze, but they don't actually KNOW it.
Not to mention, knowing a persons face and being able to actually find them anywhere in the world are two VERY different things.
Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa! -
degree7 — 10 years ago(October 08, 2015 09:34 PM)
It's the main reason the movie doesn't hold up.
Verbal has no reason to even be in the movie. He could have just guided the suspects from behind the scenes, seeing as Redfoot (and Kobayashi) was McManus's fence. And apparently, Keyser Soze is this all powerful, mythic criminal mastermind, so surely he could have just killed the suspects separately instead of concocting this overly elaborate plan to have them attack a boat. And Soze could have just had his own minions attack the boat.
Also, Verbal staying behind at the scene of the crime to be picked up by police sort of defeats the whole purpose of him getting rid of the stoolie, like you said. Now the police have his identity. Also, there was no way Verbal would have been able to kill all the "suspects" on the boat from his original position. No one noticed Verbal running around shooting people?
The movie doesn't hold up to scrutiny, imo.
~ I'm a 21st century man and I don't wanna be here. -
Stratego — 10 years ago(October 09, 2015 06:07 AM)
so surely he could have just killed the suspects separately instead of concocting this overly elaborate plan to have them attack a boat.
Except that the goal of his elaborate plan was to have the captured rat on the boat be killed, not the suspects.
And Soze could have just had his own minions attack the boat.
Why would he sacrifice his best men? That's the reason he chose the suspects, because he didn't mind them as collateral damage
Now the police have his identity.
They don't have his identity, they have no idea who he really is. They only have a face, and as said, he wasn't going to show his face ever again. Keaton was also able to disappear, even though they knew exactly who he was.
Also, there was no way Verbal would have been able to kill all the "suspects" on the boat from his original position.
How do you know what his "original position" even was?