David Giler & Walter Hill killed the franchise
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Archived from the IMDb Discussion Forums — Alien³
vnisanian2001 — 9 years ago(June 12, 2016 06:08 PM)
Seriously, what gave them the right to say "No" to the William Gibson script, which was similar to
Aliens
?
Aliens
was a huge box office hit, even more so than the first film. Those two jokers had NO clue about good business and pleasing the fans; if they did, they would have green-lit Gibson's script.
I wouldn't doubt that even today, they have no regrets about how
Alien 3
turned out. -
successor13326 — 9 years ago(June 13, 2016 03:42 PM)
Yep, you're right. What really makes me laugh is that Hill and Giler said they wanted to go in a different direction from the first two. Okay. So they hire Vincent Ward to do that. And he does that. Then suddenly they do a complete 180 and want him to tone down his medieval vision of Alien 3, make the monks convicts and make the story more conventional with a prison planet. So why even bother to hire Ward to do something different in the first place if they're just going to change their minds later on and make a poor rehash of Alien? It's crazy.
If they had gone with nearly any of the other Alien 3 scripts (Gibson, Twohy or Ward/Fasano), I think it would've made far more interesting film than the one we got. Heck, even Eric Red's awful Alien 3 script would've been more badly entertaining than the final product. -
WhiteManFromTown1986 — 9 years ago(June 16, 2016 05:52 AM)
Regarding Ward's script.
There is "going in a new direction" and then there is "going balls out bizarre" which was what Ward's screenplay basically was.
There was no way in hell they could have pulled that off because it's full of holes and lapses in logic.
*How was this planet made?
Yes, I have read and seen Ward's set up.
*How did the planet get there?
*Did a Nostromo like ship pull it?
*From where?
*The place where the wooden planet was constructed?
*Which was?
Ward is so arrogant about it lol its hilarious. As if it were supposed to be some sone sort of scifi classic "what if" lmao.
The whole medievel theme was very UN Alien.
Audiences would have welcomed it with open minds and arms lol. More like "wtf did we just watch?"
It was a good effort but to boil it down impossible to make.
So you are saying you wanted "Aliens 2" basically? More guns, grenades, and explosions. I respect that since Aliens was a classic, why not more?
It would have flopped.
Without Cameron at helm it seriosuly would have ended up being a cheap copy of Aliens with no charm. How would Newt's age difference be dealt with?
The whole reason the trilogy is so damn awesome is because each film had a great director and its own theme.
Alien was horror
Aliens was scifi action
Alien 3 was a dark character study and drama
Giler does come across as a prick at times I do admit lol, but he didnt ruin the series. 20th Century Fox and Ezra Swerdlow were the ones causing the uproar since Millions were wasted on sets that went unused.
So 20th Century Fox sent in the micromanagers to prevent that from happening again giving Fincher no creative freedom whatsoever.
Considering all the drama it turned out pretty good imo. Giler did a hell of a job with Ripley's dialogue (minus the crud line lol). She was just over it here. Jaded, tired, and angry. Even Weaver stated Giler was the only one besides Cameron who knew how to write the character.
Alien 3 no matter which script was used would of had the same fate.
"something far for savage even than nature. Oliver Thredson was, to all appearances a kindly figure" -
successor13326 — 9 years ago(June 16, 2016 07:14 PM)
The Company built the planetoid for the political dissidents. As for the wood, it could've been engineered with nanotech or other superstrength material to make it strong and secure. As for a thin atmosphere, if the society in the Alien films can come up with artificial gravity and hyperspace travel, I think they could find some way to make a shallow atmosphere, maybe with anti-gravity technology. Or perhaps it could have even been an optical illusion.
Impossible to make? I don't think so. They were going to make it, but Giler, Hill and Fox Studio screwed it up with their ridiculous demands. Maybe Alien 3 might not have been a complete success, but at least its medieval vision would've been more interesting than nameless, faceless prisoners running down endless rusty corridors and getting picked off one by one. -
WhiteManFromTown1986 — 9 years ago(June 16, 2016 09:13 PM)
Again it was way too out there. You are telling me Ward's version would of beem a succesful film? Maybe had it came out during the Inception release. It had monks and Rip havimg an abortiom? Lame.
Okay so "company" made it? Again it was still full of holes and the medievel theme wouldn't have suited the Alien universe.
The audience would have been in a state of confusion. With how shoddy the xeno imserts were done imagine how Planetoid Oak would have come across?
No Giler actually stated "how did it get there"?
Who gives 2 beep anout the bald nameless prisoners? This WAS RIPLEY"S FATE AMD HER STORY. It was meant to be unforgiving and cold.
Newt and Hicks were great, but they served their purpose in giving Rip a temporary escape. So she beep Weyland over and extermimated the xenos. Fell to her death and then joined the Aliens cast in the wonderful land known as Cameron Heaven.
"something far for savage even than nature. Oliver Thredson was, to all appearances a kindly figure" -
successor13326 — 9 years ago(June 17, 2016 05:30 PM)
The monks would've been more interesting as characters than the prisoners, even if not all of them were named. Plus, the idea of monks being attacked in the wheat field with high angles of the Alien closing in on them sounds so much more interesting to me than the final film where nameless prisoners run through the same corridors and get picked off. Not to mention the scene where the one monk is yanked through the toilet and the part where they burn the wheat fields down.
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wears-alan — 9 years ago(June 18, 2016 02:49 AM)
The monks would've been more interesting as characters than the prisoners, even if not all of them were named.
How so?
Plus, the idea of monks being attacked in the wheat field with high angles of the Alien closing in on them sounds so much more interesting to me than the final film where nameless prisoners run through the same corridors and get picked off.
It kinda seems like the scene in Jurassic Park: Lost World where the raptors get the guys in the long grass. Not exactly better really.
Not to mention the scene where the one monk is yanked through the toilet
Now that just sounds odd and belongs more in a Nightmare on Elm Street movie.
and the part where they burn the wheat fields down.
Again, not sure why that is better than what we got.
You're old enough to kill, but not for voting. -
successor13326 — 9 years ago(June 18, 2016 06:55 PM)
The monks would've been more interesting as characters than the prisoners, even if not all of them were named.
How so?
Their rejection of technology and their belief that the alien represents the devil is more intriguing than a bunch of rapists and murderers who just can't get any new tech and run screaming like chickens with their heads cut off.
Plus, the idea of monks being attacked in the wheat field with high angles of the Alien closing in on them sounds so much more interesting to me than the final film where nameless prisoners run through the same corridors and get picked off.
It kinda seems like the scene in Jurassic Park: Lost World where the raptors get the guys in the long grass. Not exactly better really.
Disagree. I think it would have been a very enjoyable, suspenseful scene.
Not to mention the scene where the one monk is yanked through the toilet.
Now that just sounds odd and belongs more in a Nightmare on Elm Street movie.
Again, I disagree.
and the part where they burn the wheat fields down.
Again, not sure why that is better than what we got.
It would be more beautiful and artistic than the prisoners running down similar drab tunnels. -
wears-alan — 9 years ago(June 19, 2016 03:32 AM)
Their rejection of technology and their belief that the alien represents the devil is more intriguing than a bunch of rapists and murderers who just can't get any new tech and run screaming like chickens with their heads cut off.
As opposed to the prisoners who found God, rejected modern technology (ie, the chance to leave when the facility was being mothballed) and seen the Alien as the devil.
Disagree. I think it would have been a very enjoyable, suspenseful scene.
I'm not saying it wouldn't have been enjoyable. But no better than the prisoners being chased down claustrophobic corridors.
You disagree that a monk being pulled down a toilet seems more akin to a Nightmare on Elm Street movie? Oh right. In that case I disagree with you. See how that works?
It would be more beautiful and artistic than the prisoners running down similar drab tunnels.
I see. In that case, guess what? I disagree with you.
Alien 3 is considered stupid by a lot of people, but the idea of monks travelling around space on a wooden planet is beyond stupid.
You're old enough to kill, but not for voting. -
Filimon — 9 years ago(June 27, 2016 02:12 PM)
The whole monks/prisoners in space idea was something Ward litteraly came up with on the plane to first meeting with Fox. It was a wacky idea that would fit into a stand alone film but not in the Alien series. I would have liked his original vision compared to what we got thou.
Aliens set up a sequel to go in many possible good directions. I Think it could have been on par with the previous entries even.
It could go into action, horror or a mix of both. It could involve one or more of the surviving characters. Ripley was not nessecarily the focal Point. Her arc was done after Aliens anyway. The notion it had to be so very different compared to the previous was the reason it got so messy. They twisted themselves into a lame compromise that repeated what we had seen Before and done better anyway. -
Filimon — 9 years ago(June 28, 2016 11:11 AM)
It absolutely did with 4 survivors! We (as most people watching Aliens) would love to see more adventures with Ripley, Hicks, Bishop and possibly Newt. They were well liked characters that could carry over to Another setting. It would continue something and develop the character relations instead of pressing the reset button like 3 and 4 did.
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wears-alan — 9 years ago(June 28, 2016 01:40 PM)
Don't agree.
The last thing I wanted was Ripley and her Alien hunting family.
It would have been better if Aliens was the conclusion of her nightmare and Fox had been brave enough to continue without Ellen Ripley. They weren't. But an Alien hunting family would have been too silly for me. Killing them all was sad, but hey, who said life is fair?
The greatest trick the Devil played was convincing people he didn't exist.. -
Filimon — 9 years ago(July 14, 2016 10:05 AM)
I dont like the Alien hunting family either. But I do Think Ripley and Hicks had a good Chemistry. He was the only character that Ripley really liked and trusted. Like that softness in her Eyes when she is interacting with Hicks. And Bishop was an awesome character by Lance!